Roman Catholicism Admits Orthodox Positions...Again: David Erhan & Snek with Jay Dyer
In a recent discussion, Jay Dyer and his guests David Erhan and Snek critically analyze recent Vatican admissions regarding Eastern Orthodox perspectives and the implications for church authority. They examine historical schisms, particularly the establishment of parallel jurisdictions during the Crusades, and highlight how Roman Catholic claims of singular authority are contradicted by these events. The conversation also emphasizes the acknowledgment of Orthodox ecclesiology, particularly regarding synodality, while critiquing the papacy's historical and political dominance. The dialogue calls into question the validity of Catholic claims about ecumenical councils and stresses the need for resolution of doctrinal differences before any potential reconciliation between the Roman Catholic and Orthodox Churches.
Chain 6 steps
- Snek: The document admits loss of synodality in the Roman Catholic Church.“the Roman Catholic Church essentially, in some sense, thinks that it has lost some senses of what it calls synodality.”
- David Erhan: Apostolic Canon 34 establishes a relation among bishops without granting supremacy to a primate.
- Jay Dyer: The Roman Catholic view of ecumenical councils has changed over time“So this shows us that they clearly, in that year, in the 7th century, nobody had the mindset that all that's needed for an ecumenical council is simply the approval of the Roman bishop.”
- Snek: The decisions made at Council of Florence directly contradict St. Maximus“the council of Florence says it is, but St. Maximus confessor says that the Holy spirit...is not a cause of the Holy spirit.”
- Jay Dyer: There is a contradiction in Roman Catholic claims and historic positions.“that's called a contradiction, Roman Catholics.”
- Jay Dyer: The idea of competing ecclesiologies undermines a singular, patristic understanding of the church.“there is one ecclesiology... that's good enough.”
Subjects
23Jay argues that Vatican I's theological assertions are challenged by the recent admissions in documents like the Alexandria document.
Jay and his guests discuss the Council of Florence, pointing out significant theological blunders and emphasizing that its decisions were not accepted by the Greek Orthodox Church.
Jay Dyer argues that Roman Catholic claims about the papacy's unity and guidance are unfounded and emphasizes that the documents from the papacy often promote heretical positions.
Jay critiques the rigidity of the papal system in Roman Catholicism, arguing that it doesn't allow for genuine theological flexibility.
Jay argues that the assertion of synodality and primacy as complementary is flawed, emphasizing that there should not be competing ecclesiologies.
Jay argues that Roman Catholic claims of authority are contradictory and not historically supported by Eastern Orthodox perspectives.
Jay Dyer references the Chieti Document to argue that it contradicts Catholic apologists by stating that ecumenical councils are recognized by the church as a whole, not simply by the approval of the Pope.
Jay Dyer highlights that the canons of Sardaca demonstrate an appeals process to bishops that does not solely rely on the Bishop of Rome, challenging claims of papal supremacy.
David Erhan discusses the historical context of the Orthodox Church's synodality and the implications of the Catholic Church's recognition of this.
Jay points out the admissions of doctrinal development in the recent Vatican documents as a challenge to the traditional Catholic claim of unbroken papal authority.
Jay asserts that Lateran 649 was not conceived of as ecumenical by the Roman Catholic Church because it lacked imperial approval, highlighting the differing views on what constitutes an ecumenical council.
Snek discusses the continuity of synodality in the Orthodox Church despite external pressures, emphasizing the Church's ability to make binding decisions.